BavidDrent January 1, 2022 at 9:13 PM
- January 1, 2022 at 9:13 PM
Looks pretty cool, but I'm not sure it would be able to do that much that the Kemper stage can't do.
It would be quicker, better UI/connectivity - but for everything else what do you reckon?
- January 1, 2022 at 11:28 PM
It's a whole different piece of gear with different strengths and weaknesses. And of course it's a modeler and not a profiler. I understand if it's not something you're interested in, but I don't think it's an apples to apples comparison to a Kemper Stage.
- January 2, 2022 at 2:30 AM
No. Not interested.
- January 2, 2022 at 2:59 AM
Looper in FM9 is longer (120 seconds), it has built in synth (you can create drone and jam over it), flexible routing, many more effects. But it is a modeler, so you're stuck with what it models (it models a lot though, so I don't consider it as a huge disadvantage). Editing patches on Fractal devices is miserable experience, in my opinion and to get most out of it you need to connect it to computer. KPA has more straightforward workflow, at least for me. KPA is a stable platform and updates don't change sound which is not the case in Fractal world which tends to do hardware revisions quite often and from time to time releases firmware which changes sound of patches. KPA it cheaper in a long run (free, high quality updates for last 10 years!).
Overall both are great platforms and you can't go wrong with any - both sound and feel great. If you already have Stage I don't think investment in FM9 would be the best move. If you had nothing yet you could toss a coin and probably you'd be happy with either platform.
- January 2, 2022 at 3:39 AM
Quote from piotrmaj
Editing patches on Fractal devices is miserable experience...
This. It's like comically bad. Frankly I don't think the editor is much better.
- January 2, 2022 at 10:51 PM
Quote from piotrmaj
Looper in FM9 is longer (120 seconds), it has built in synth (you can create drone and jam over it), flexible routing, many more effects. But it is a modeler, so you're stuck with what it models (it models a lot though, so I don't consider it as a huge disadvantage). Editing patches on Fractal devices is miserable experience, in my opinion and to get most out of it you need to connect it to computer. KPA has more straightforward workflow, at least for me. KPA is a stable platform and updates don't change sound which is not the case in Fractal world which tends to do hardware revisions quite often and from time to time releases firmware which changes sound of patches. KPA it cheaper in a long run (free, high quality updates for last 10 years!).
Overall both are great platforms and you can't go wrong with any - both sound and feel great. If you already have Stage I don't think investment in FM9 would be the best move. If you had nothing yet you could toss a coin and probably you'd be happy with either platform.
I have both. Frankly, if the same question were put to me you would get the exact opposite answer. I like my Kemper, but it really does not match the flexibility and sound quality of my Axe-Fx III.
- January 2, 2022 at 11:09 PM
Quote from SASouth
but it really does not match the flexibility and sound quality of my Axe-Fx III.
i own both too but i prefer my Kemper Stage
- January 2, 2022 at 11:13 PM
Quote from piotrmaj
Editing patches on Fractal devices is miserable experience,
if you dont have experience editing presets on the fractal devices it will be miserable for you,for me is super easy to edit presets on the Axe 3,
- January 2, 2022 at 11:41 PM
I am highly interested and I am in fact on the waiting list (not located in the US, so I will have to wait).
It will not replace my Kemper Stage, though.- January 2, 2022 at 11:50 PM
Quote from joshriggs
This. It's like comically bad. Frankly I don't think the editor is much better.
I don't know about Fractal user experience and ease of editing. But the Kemper UI (Stage, iPad app and MacOS RigManager) leaves much to be desired. The user experience - at least to me - is outdated and incomplete. Just my two cents.
- January 3, 2022 at 1:42 AM
I have one and a quad cortex, I still use my Kemper stage for ease of use overall for live playing. Still hope they will eventually release a Stage 2.
- January 3, 2022 at 5:24 PM
Quote from andyrukus
I don't know about Fractal user experience and ease of editing. But the Kemper UI (Stage, iPad app and MacOS RigManager) leaves much to be desired. The user experience - at least to me - is outdated and incomplete. Just my two cents.
Yeah, there are things to be improved for sure, but it's still light years ahead of Fractal.
- January 3, 2022 at 5:38 PM
I have both. As stated, they are kind of different animals. There are things I like about each of them and is the reason I have kept both. Editing on the Fractal devices with the editor has been made easier than it was in earlier times. I still feel that the amp sounds are better with the Kemper. I find them to be more accurate to amps I actually own, not that you can't get good sounds out of the FM9 using the models of the same amps.
It really comes down to splitting hairs with the two. They both have strengths and weaknesses. You can get great tones out of each of them. I would say that if someone is saying that one blows the other one out of the water, they are not being objective. Both units are capable of fantastic tones. My biggest recommendation is to look at the UI and start there. If the UI does not work for you, the unit will only frustrate you and you will sell it. Many hate the way you edit the Fractal products. To me, you have to put the time in to learn it. A lot of folks have issues with Rig Manager. It does act up a bit. The trade offs are in the UI and the editors IMHO.
- January 3, 2022 at 6:56 PM
Quote from SASouth
I like my Kemper, but it really does not match the flexibility and sound quality of my Axe-Fx III.
Just wondering since the Kemper can sound exactly like what it profiles, (so good top producers and engineers can't tell the difference including Michael Wagner) How can anything sound better than exactly like the original device it's profiled to sound like? In about 99% of blind tests I've witnessed most people couldn't tell the Kemper from the amp it profiled and in fact most of the time chose the Kemper as being "better" than the original amp sound profiled I'm guessing because of the musical way it packages everything.
- January 3, 2022 at 8:20 PM
A profile is a snapshot of an amp with specific settings. Make any changes to the tone stack and it is no longer an accurate representation of the actual amplifier and sound quality suffers. That’s why there are always multiple profiles provided from vendors for a single amp. If this wasn’t the case then vendors would only need to produce one profile for each amp.
The reason that I point out Fractal’s flexibility and sound quality is that Fractal models the actual amp including the entire tone stack top to bottom. You can tweak the knobs just like the physical amp and get the same results in the model as you would with the actual amp. This allows for you to tailor your sound without having to search for the perfect profile.
As a fellow Kemper user I am sure you can at least admit that there is a wide range of quality among all of the profiles available for any particular amp.
There are some really great profiles out there, but having to wade through all of the crap to get to them is a bit tiring.- January 3, 2022 at 10:47 PM
I've bought pro profiles, made my own, and download hundreds of free ones. I can rarely recall a single one I didn't adjust or add anything to it to make it "better". First thing I ever profiled was a dual Amp setup with a 50 percent double cab Sim from my pod hd500 and it sounded better on its own but after adjusting every possible parameter in the kemper I got a tone that felt and sounded 10 times what I had started with. So to me, in no way could it sound better from the source for sure if the accuracy is 90 to 99 percent give or take, but if altered additions are factored in then where taking it to 105 to 115 percent better overall. If they're not gonna make it smaller than they should make it bigger. Basically pointing to just more effects from their perspective it looks like. They have no interest it seems in dual Amp, dual cab, multiple mic inputs etc. And if their feeling is you need to bring your own extra effects they might not even do that. I hope they do tho. WE, wanna see a Kemper 2, whatever that's going to be, even if they don't really want to this or that.
- January 3, 2022 at 11:44 PM
Quote from Awesome_Elvis
They have no interest it seems in dual Amp, dual cab, multiple mic inputs etc. And if their feeling is you need to bring your own extra effects they might not even do that. I hope they do tho. WE, wanna see a Kemper 2, whatever that's going to be, even if they don't really want to this or that.
i own the axe 3 but i never use a preset with double amp,for me the Kemper sound awesome just with one amp,if Kemper is not for you move out to another device
- January 4, 2022 at 2:01 AM
Quote from Awesome_Elvis
WE, wanna see a Kemper 2, whatever that's going to be, even if they don't really want to this or that.
I understand there are always going to be those that aren't happy with what many have and are happy with, and have to have the "new thing" all of the time. They wouldn't be happy with a Kemper 2 for long either. For me, "snapshots" are fine. Previously when I used Line 6.rack units etc. I was basically using snapshots anyway. And now my "snapshots" sound and feel exactly like the amp profiled so at this point I can't see much room for improvement. With the right profiles, very little tweeking needs done to get sounds that will rival or beat all of the best sounds I grew up with listening to. There really is a finite amount of guitar sounds available in the world and all the amps in the world. Using profiles that suit, usually just a but of eqing is needed to get the sounds I'm looking for without compromise.
- January 4, 2022 at 3:27 AM
I could see a model that just has more effects slots and more morphing snapshots per preset or something like that. Maybe an option for built in stereo power Amp ( in a floor unit this would slay, IMO.)
Maybe more eq in more places with different options for type (input eq , pre and post Amp at the same time, more cabinet eq, post cab etc.) That is to say if can't or won't add anymore.
I mean, if they're not gonna do anything with the profiling portion and they're not gonna make a stomp size Kemper then all I can see that's left is more like a Kemper Deluxe Supreme rather than an actual Kemper 2. Same basic idea and layout but with more effects and a few extras here and there. It really wouldn't kill them to make the next Gen with enough profiling and processing power to profile pedals, pedal combinations, pre and power Amp as separate profiles etc.
Having the ability to modify every step of your signal chain at gain staging increments is a nice feature and would add another layer of sonic exploration. I suppose we can do this now in some ways but then it doesn't leave much room for other effects.
- January 4, 2022 at 9:01 AM
After another round of jamming the current big 3 (in headphones), I have come to this temporary conclusion.
Quad cortex is the most instant gratification soundwise. Easiest to get a great detailed sound and has an electric hairyness that's very pleasing to the ears but it's a bit like eating lots of candy and leaves you with a feeling like maybe I shouldn't do this for too long but you do it anyways. Very thick scholastic, and splayed sound.
FM9 hands down the best sounding effects (for the most part). Hope the cortex can catch up and bigger hopes Kemper will come through eventually as well. I love the kemper and cortex effects but FM9 just slays there. Amp tones are great and all with a vibe of their own but I did spend the most time tweaking here. I can navigate just fine and know a few tricks to get where I want but it is a lot of back and forth, up and down side to side. Amp switching with foot buttons need work arounds to close that gap in audio when doing certain amp switching maneuvers.
Kemper all in all still holds its weight in tone and feel with further extensions of extra sonic capabilites. I added more gain to a Mbritt dumble profile and then boosted the front end and used a different cab. Absolutely slapped. I'm gonna dream about a new Kemper that has Fractal level effects and routing. I suppose I could just use the fm9 in 4 cable mode but sure would be nice to have this all in one. There are for sure some very unique kemper effects and sounds, it's just a damn shame there isn't more room for them. At this point I would even buy a Kemper Effects Only unit if they had one and use it for guitar, synths and vocals. One could only imagine a unit as flexible and powerful as the other units but loaded to the teeth with current and, new and improved Kemper effects. Your(and my) 2 cents may vary.
